The ATF has been a train wreck for many years. From the Fast and Furious gun running scandal to contradictory confusing regulations, this federal agency has been a thorn in the side of gun owners and the American people for decades.
Finally, Congressman Sensenbrenner has put forth a bill to eliminate the ATF and wrap their duties into existing agencies:
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The ATF Elimination Act would transfer law enforcement powers over firearms, explosives and arson to the FBI, while enforcement over alcohol and tobacco would go to the Drug Enforcement Agency. Sensenbrenner noted in a statement Thursday that elimination of the ATF would be a beneficial to cutting government spending.
“Common sense budgeting solutions are necessary, and the ATF Elimination Act is one measure we can take to reduce spending, redundancy, and practice responsible governance,” said Sensenbrenner. “The ATF is a scandal-ridden, largely duplicative agency that has been branded by failure and lacks a clear mission. It is plagued by backlogs, funding gaps, hiring challenges, and a lack of leadership.”
Sensenbrenner noted that cutting the ATF would help “begin draining the swamp” and would be in the “best interest” of taxpayers.
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The ATF’s functions related to guns and explosives would be transferred to the FBI, while the ATF’s duties related to tobacco and alcohol would go to the DEA. Not only would this reduce government waste and duplicity, it would also eliminate a highly politicized government bureaucracy that is outright hostile to gun owners. The ATF was apparently fine with the Obama administration misusing statistics about their failed Fast and Furious gun running scheme to advance gun control. In fact, some more cynical observers, have suggested that the primary purpose of Fast and Furious was to advance gun control.
The ATF has a long history of making political decisions for the enforcement and interpretation of laws pertaining to gun dealers and manufacturers. It’s hard to imagine the FBI doing a worse job than the ATF is already doing when it comes to the rule of law. The bottom line is that this bill is a good thing for gun owners and dealers.
Good get rid of them we don’t need all these agencies
rn
I think it is a good idea to reduce the size of government !!!
Will it help the gun owners of America ???
We can only hope it will…
“The ATF has a long history of making political decisions for the enforcement and interpretation of laws pertaining to gun dealers and manufacturers. It’s hard to imagine the FBI doing a worse job than the ATF is already doing when it comes to the rule of law. The bottom line is that this bill is a good thing for gun owners and dealers.”
Think President Trump will have to drain the swamp in both the FBI and the FDA before splitting duties of the ATF between the two. As corrupt as the FDA is presently, it would make more sense to abolish the FDA and shift their duties to the CDC, but the CDC also needs to have their swamp drained first.
For those who do not know, there was allegedly 3 undetonated bombs (?not specifed if professional or home made) in the Murrah Office Bldg. in Oklahoma that had allegedly had fingerprints of 3 different FBI agents on them. Of course the FBI at first denied they were there, but finally admitted they were illegally storing some bombsP, so they must have been professional or made by the FBI.
The FDA has now become the attack pit bull for big industry, especially the pharmaceutical manufacturers and large dairies and food processors. The FDA is well known for over reaching their authority running around raiding and destroying raw milk (which I can never recall any outbreak attached to it) which is much healthier than the pasteurized and homogenized versions still called milk.
The USDA has also become the champion fighters for the Monsanto GMO seeds and the big farming industries. Both the USDA and the FDA are adamant about forcing them to label the GMO produce so those of us who know the damage they do can avoid them, and the way the dark act passed was worded, both the organic farmers and the GMO seed producer users can voluntarily label their product – but it is also worded to scare the organic out of business. The FDA and the USDA both were already hounding the small organic farmer before they passed the dark act.
think
Wondering Woman, Welcome to the ‘Criminal Government Investigators’ fraternity. There’s a lot to ‘know’ about this stuff. You don’t know the half of the OK bombing cover up. (one of my specialties). And don’t forget the BLM (remember the Nevada/Bundy Fascism and summary execution at Malheur wildlife refuge) hand the biggy…agenda 21. This is a real time happening threat to your private control over your own property. I just attended a so-called public meeting on ‘designating’ a certain areas of the county to be ‘wildlife and forest’ restoration ‘sanctuaries’ by state purview and ‘authority’. Small newspaper article highlighting what the state wants to do and where the ‘public meeting would be held, but the small print you had to dig for in the written proposal would make George Orwell spin in his grave. Not many attended. I was politely accused of being an agitator and was told to leave for asking questions they didn’t want to answer.
Now’s the time to shut it all down. And it’s the last chance we’re going to get.
Eradicating ATF would be good [if not great] in starting to reduce the physical size of the gov’t. [Would it be good for the safety & security of the nation? IDK & that’s another story. And, no! I’m not ignorant of nor forgetful that PPO mentioned “the Fast & the Furious scandal” or that Mr. Sensenbrenner mentioned that “the agency is scandal-ridden.”]
But the [scope of] powers & the responsibilities wouldn’t necessarily be automatically reduced along w/ the eradication of the agency (nor necessarily always w/ the eradication of any gov’t entity,) contrary to popular belief.
Just ‘cuz Congress drafts, passes & sends legislation to the Pres. that puts powers into effect outside the purview of extant entities, & new governing bodies HAVE to be ‘automatically’ created (organized, if you will) to exercise those powers, & just ‘cuz the Commander-and-Chief (not Commander-in-Chief, as many people from all walks of life mistakenly believe, even Pres. themselves) might enact (sign) the legislation into law – when a gov’t agency or other such entity is eradicated, their [scope of] powers & responsibilities don’t necessarily get automatically eradicated too. (The reason I’m saying all of this is because there are many people, including some on this forum, who seem to think or believe that gov’t entities automatically get power(s) when they’re created, & that those powers automatically disappear into thin air when entities are eradicated; such aren’t always the case.]
What was essentially pointed out in the PPO post is that the powers & responsibilities will be TRANSFERRED TO & DIVIDED BETWEEN (not REDUCED) different agencies – firearms, guns & arson to the FBI, & alcohol & tobacco to the DEA.
Transference & division of powers & responsibilities doesn’t necessarily mean the automatic reduction [nor any (type of) modification] of the scope of (those) powers (&, by extension, the responsibilities) of the eradicated entities. Lots of times, those [scope of powers (& responsibilities)] have to be addressed on their own merits. That’s not to say always separately from the agencies/entities at the time of modification. At times, the powers & responsibilities can & have to be addressed in conjunction w/ any (type of) modification of any gov’t entity that has (or had) those enumerated powers & responsibilities.
At other times, they can be [but don’t necessarily have to be] addressed truly separately [from the entities, not from each other, though]. But they must always be addressed together, no matter what.
So sometimes, scope of powers & responsibilities (& themselves) does (& do) automatically modify w/ the modifying of gov’t entities. But most of the time, it doesn’t (& they don’t). And why not? I’m not sure about that.
Now, as to the 3 things Mr. Sensenbrenner mentioned about the ATF, in relation to the ATF Elimination Act: “reduce SPENDING, REDUNDANCY, and PRACTICE RESPONSIBLE GOVERNANCE,” (my own emphasis).
Reduction of “spending”? Hmmm, maybe. But the FBI & DEA agents just might want more pay, either in the form of a ‘regular’ raise, (more) hazard pay &/or some other way (& I’m assuming that’s even slightly possible, if at all). So, spending MIGHT be reduced, but it COULD be kept the same or EVEN increased. IF reduced, by how much & why? Same question for the hypothetical spending increase. And the following questions pertain, as well, to the spending reductions or hypothetical increases [whichever 1 occurs]: Will those reductions or currently hypothetical increases be a little, a lot or somewhere in between? And, just as importantly & urgently, Why? (on all those questions).
But if the spending is kept @ the same, current level, how much is it & why is it kept @ that level!? (Even adjusting for inflation, deflation or whatever else.) Let’s hope THAT spending DOES get reduced, if not eliminated completely.
As to “redundancy.” That might effectually (if not effectively) be completely eliminated [hopefully completely,] but that won’t necessarily affect the effectual ‘toe-stepping’/
‘turf-invading’ that all the agencies (FBI, ATF, DEA, CIA, NSA, DHS, etc.) have done to one another for decades. So, reduction of “redundancy” occuring? I highly doubt it! And, isn’t “overlapping” the SAME THING? ;; Just saying (& asking ;).
And as to “responsible governance.” HA, HA, HAAAA! That’s a joke. It very well could be that the ATF is 1 of the worst (if not the worst) run entities in the gov’t, but are the FBI & DEA (&, for that matter, any other federal law enforcement & civilian defense entities) run any better? That’s debatable & up to individual POV’s. To my mind, they all are currently @ the same low-level of competence (which is very low,) or some could be a bit better than others; IDK, & their ‘level of competence’ also is debatable. But anyway, just because the organizations (may) have a (clear) group of leaders & command structure (i.e. director, deputy director, etc.) (w/ the possible exception of the ATF) doesn’t necessarily mean that those leaders have the abilities, qualities, capabilities &/or personal inner capacity(ies) for the leadership position/office, rank, etc they’re in, or hold, even though they may have the authority, power, knowledge & understanding of the leadership position. And, it’s not just the leaders & their (lack of) capabilities et al. It’s also every person in those orgs & their (lack of) capabilities et al. Also personalities, moods, attitudes, mentalities, actions, responsiveness, personal responsibility (& responsibilities,) competence & a bunch of other stuff too numerous to list here, pertain to them, as well.
And now, a side note: “Responsibility is the ability to respond to (something, some situation, etc).” Something to think about.
There was more I wanted to ‘speak’ on, but my post got too long aways back. But, I’ve hit all the major points I wanted to ‘speak’ on, which is currently sufficient for my purposes. So I’ll end it here.
The ATF had a ‘validity’ issue that became a monkey on its back since WACO. It still can’t justify itself if anybody realty thinks about it, as I explained a minute ago in another comment. Integrating them into other agencies is really no big deal, as I mentioned.
As far as the FBI and DEA asking for more money to support the transition, I doubt they’d stand up to justifiable balance sheet scrutiny for that when it came right down to counting the beans. It’s all about the cost effectiveness v. the value production, and in a ‘REALITY’ business world, Not a political one, Trump is only about the money, also. So the ATF should start searching for their burial plot.
But more hopefully, maybe this new administration will get moving on disbanding the DEA Also!? Maybe Rand Paul could be encouraged to sponsor that heavenly Bill on the heels of repealing this heinous criminal DEA progeny of the War on Drugs known as ‘Asset Forfeiture Seizure’ laws???
Now’s the Time!
….shut down the ATF – along with many other agencies and fire their gun banning scum employees
The ATF’s scurrilous Anti-Constitutional 2nd/A hating function, notwithstanding at the moment, Pragmatically There’s simply nothing the ATF does than can’t be taken over by local municipalities and state governments already, at little or no additional cost. Most county Sherriff’s departments already have Swat teams trained in counterterrorism, and bomb sniffing dogs are readily available everywhere, and many cities have officers who are trained with explosive ordnance handling. All State Police have equipment for this. All states have offices/agencies that handle alcohol licensing, Cigarette commerce, and anything else the ‘AT’ part includes. Their function in this capacity is uselessly and expensively redundant.
If the ATF’s major selling point is bomb work, that could be easily taking care of by providing a state on call job for any Veteran who’s mos was bomb diffusing in the middle East wars the last 10 years and they are the best in the world, and there’s quite a few of them. But it wouldn’t be as dangerous because the state or big City could purchase the most advanced robots (and I mean really advanced) on a government grant with all the vast money the Federal government would save disbanding This cancer agency which only really functions for one purpose, and one purpose only As a gestapo arm of the Totalitarian Marxist faction of the government to dismantle the 2nd/A to then Disarm the Patriot populate.
Any agency that has nothing better to do than to try to administratively ban more than five rounds in a shotgun magazine tube, keep people from protecting their hearing with enforcing draconian laws on a piece of tube to suppress a gunshot noise, or tries to stop the flow of ammunition to private citizens like their latest endeavor to re-classify wetted bulk nitrocellulose for gunpowder manufacturing as a high explosive to eventually make ammo more costly is criminally wasting our tax dollars and does, indeed, need to have Trumps reduced government hatchet team take a close look at it. Before they get nervous and do another WACO number.
We ought to all give thanks for this Congressman Sennsenberger and give as much support as possible through passing the word, donations, and by telling our own state legislators to support this bill immediately and PASS IT! Or ELSE!
Down size or get rid of all alphabet agencies and get us out of the UN. Obama, the traitor has set us up for UN gun grabbing by signing the UN small arms treaty. Trump needs quickly to at least get us out of that agreement and quite possibly UNexit.
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